NFC South...NO Comparison..BUCS ON TOP

[BaDaBinGnRT]

Carolina Panthers

QB Jake Delhomme
RB Stephen Davis
FB Brad Hoover
WR Steve Smith
WR Mushin Muhhamid
WR Ricky Proehl
TE Kris Magmum
LT Jorgan Gross
LG Travelle Wharton
C Jeff Mitchell
RG Doug Brezinski
RT Adam Meadows

LE Julius Peppers
DT Kris Jenkins
DT Breston Buckner
RE Mike Rucker
LB Will Witherspoon
LB Dan Morgan
LB Jessie Armstead
CB Ricky Manning Jr
CB Chris Gamble
CB Terrance Shaw
FS Mike Minter
SS Jarrod Cooper

K John Kasey
P Todd Sauerbrun



---NOT LOOKING TO GOOD FOR THEM. Decent team, but no way they even come close to repeating last years performance.

New Orlean Saints

QB Aaron Brooks
RB Deuce McAllister
FB Sam Gash
WR Joe Horn
WR Donte' Stalworth
WR Jerome Pathon
TE Boo Williams/Ernie Conwell
LT Wayne Gandy
LG LeCharles Bentley
C Kevin Houser
RG Montrae Holland
RT Victor Riley

LE Darren Howard
DT Johnathon Sullivan
DT Brian Young
RE Will Smith
LB Courtney Watson
LB Orlando Ruff
LB Sedrick Hodge
CB Ashley Ambrose
CB Fred Thomas
CB Jason Craft
FS Tebucky Jones
SS Jay Bellemy

K John Carney
P Mitch Berger

-Ugh....another sub par season for them looks in the making. That defense is horrific with exception to the average D line.


Atlanta Falcons
QB Mike Vick
RB Warrick Dunn
FB Justin Griffith
WR Peerless Price
WR Dez White
WR Michael Jenkins
TE Alge Crumpler
LT Bob Whitfield
LG Eric Beverely
C Robert Garza
RG Kynan Forney
RT Kevin Shaffer

LE Patrick Kerney
DT Rod Coleman
RE Brady Smith

LB Keith Brooking
LB Jamie Duncan
LB Matt Stewart
LB Demorrio Williams
CB Deangelo Hall
CB Jason Webster
CB Derek Ross
FS Corey Hall
SS Keion Carpenter

K Jay Feely
P Chris Mohr

-i must admit the Falcons look better then the saints, and around near the same talent as the Panthers.


Tampa Bay Buccaneers
QB Brad Johnson
RB Charlie Garner
FB Mike Alstott
WR Keenan McCardell
WR Joey Galloway
WR Michael Clayton
TE Ken Dilger/Rickey Dudley
LT Derrick Deese
LG Matt Stinchcomb
C John Wade
RG Cosey Coleman/Matt Odwer
RT Todd Steussie

LE Greg Spires
DT Anthony McFarland
DT Ellis Wyms
RE Simeon Rice
LB Derrick Brooks
LB Ian Gold
LB Shelton Quarles
CB Ronde Barber
CB Brian Kelly
CB Mario Edwards
FS Dwight Smith
SS Jermaine Phillips

K Martin Gramatica
P Josh Bidwell

-This team may regain control of the division, as they look darn good on paper.

[TheFalconArmy]

The Bucs D still looks pretty solid, but unless Brad plays over his head (which he won't), I don't see that offense making any noise..... You better hope the D carries you again ala 2002.....

[2HeadedMonster]

Oh yeah, that was some great analysis there, and thank you for filling us in on the current starting rosters.:D:D:D

[Chunko]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
The Bucs D still looks pretty solid, but unless Brad plays over his head (which he won't), I don't see that offense making any noise..... You better hope the D carries you again ala 2002.....

Bucs were 10th in overall offense and 3rd in passing offense last year with one of the worst offensive lines and without their #1 and #3 Wrs for most of the season. How exactly has the Bucs offense gotten worse?

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by Chunko
Bucs were 10th in overall offense and 3rd in passing offense last year with one of the worst offensive lines and without their #1 and #3 Wrs for most of the season. How exactly has the Bucs offense gotten worse?


Old man Galloway doesn't have what JJ had last year....... and Brad Johnson is only going to get worse as he pushes 40......

[Chunko]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Old man Galloway doesn't have what JJ had last year....... and Brad Johnson is only going to get worse as he pushes 40......

Old man Galloway is the deep threat they never had. Even if Brad doesn't have the arm strength to get him the ball, he'll still stretch the field. Jurevicius is still on the team. Johnson hasn't actually looked all that bad for a 35yr old QB. The improved Oline should give him more time and less holes to climb out of from penalties. It's not going to be a spectacular offense, but it shows signs of improving. Special teams is the one aspect I'm worried about.

[UdinG]

I totally agree. Barring injuries, the Bucs should easily win the division.

Falcons - improved, but not there yet. Vick has nightmares about playing the Bucs.

Saints - Just cant seem to stop choking.

Panthers - 2nd coming of the 2001 Bears. Fluke. They'll stink this year.

The Bucs will most likely be the only one of these teams with a winning record this year.

[BucPride2003]

Originally posted by UdinG
I totally agree. Barring injuries, the Bucs should easily win the division.

Falcons - improved, but not there yet. Vick has nightmares about playing the Bucs.

Saints - Just cant seem to stop choking.

Panthers - 2nd coming of the 2001 Bears. Fluke. They'll stink this year.

The Bucs will most likely be the only one of these teams with a winning record this year.

Falcons, barring injury to Mick Vick, will go 8-8 or 9-7. Thats what they should hope for.

Saints.....don't choke at the end.

Panthers, i won't say anything about a fluke, but I would only expect a 8-8 or 9-7 team.

[PirateAttack]

Originally posted by UdinG
Panthers - 2nd coming of the 2001 Bears. Fluke. They'll stink this year.

Zing! :p

[Heelinfine]

Originally posted by UdinG
I totally agree. Barring injuries, the Bucs should easily win the division.


Panthers - 2nd coming of the 2001 Bears. Fluke. They'll stink this year.

The Bucs will most likely be the only one of these teams with a winning record this year.



Careful there UdinG, it's a little early to hand anyone in the division the title (including my Panthers). TB may win the South, but it is there for the taking for any team that gells at the right time.


You can't call the Panthers a fluke, like the 2001 Bears yet. 1st of all the Pnathers made it to the Super Bowl and dang near won it. The bears were defeated in the 1st rd. 2nd of all the Panthers haven't played a game yet this year. If they got 3-13 than your comparison to the 2001 Bears would be vaildated, but not yet.


P.S. But you just keep on predicting UdinG because I like the results. Wasn't you one of the great prognasticators that guranteed the Panthers would lose in the 1st rd of last years playoffs? :p

[Bucamaniac40]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
The Bucs D still looks pretty solid, but unless Brad plays over his head (which he won't), I don't see that offense making any noise..... You better hope the D carries you again ala 2002..... Review the O line upgrades and call us back!

[buccaneer49]

Originally posted by UdinG
I totally agree. Barring injuries, the Bucs should easily win the division.

Falcons - improved, but not there yet. Vick has nightmares about playing the Bucs.

Saints - Just cant seem to stop choking.

Panthers - 2nd coming of the 2001 Bears. Fluke. They'll stink this year.

The Bucs will most likely be the only one of these teams with a winning record this year.

And I agree with you also, I see the Bucs on top this year, can't wait for the season to begin! GO BUCS

[BucFanInIL]

Originally posted by BaDaBinGnRT
Carolina Panthers

QB Jake Delhomme
RB Stephen Davis
FB Brad Hoover
WR Steve Smith
WR Mushin Muhhamid
WR Ricky Proehl
TE Kris Magmum
LT Jorgan Gross
LG Travelle Wharton
C Jeff Mitchell
RG Doug Brezinski
RT Adam Meadows

LE Julius Peppers
DT Kris Jenkins
DT Breston Buckner
RE Mike Rucker
LB Will Witherspoon
LB Dan Morgan
LB Jessie Armstead
CB Ricky Manning Jr
CB Chris Gamble
CB Terrance Shaw
FS Mike Minter
SS Jarrod Cooper

K John Kasey
P Todd Sauerbrun



---NOT LOOKING TO GOOD FOR THEM. Decent team, but no way they even come close to repeating last years performance.

New Orlean Saints

QB Aaron Brooks
RB Deuce McAllister
FB Sam Gash
WR Joe Horn
WR Donte' Stalworth
WR Jerome Pathon
TE Boo Williams/Ernie Conwell
LT Wayne Gandy
LG LeCharles Bentley
C Kevin Houser
RG Montrae Holland
RT Victor Riley

LE Darren Howard
DT Johnathon Sullivan
DT Brian Young
RE Will Smith
LB Courtney Watson
LB Orlando Ruff
LB Sedrick Hodge
CB Ashley Ambrose
CB Fred Thomas
CB Jason Craft
FS Tebucky Jones
SS Jay Bellemy

K John Carney
P Mitch Berger

-Ugh....another sub par season for them looks in the making. That defense is horrific with exception to the average D line.


Atlanta Falcons
QB Mike Vick
RB Warrick Dunn
FB Justin Griffith
WR Peerless Price
WR Dez White
WR Michael Jenkins
TE Alge Crumpler
LT Bob Whitfield
LG Eric Beverely
C Robert Garza
RG Kynan Forney
RT Kevin Shaffer

LE Patrick Kerney
DT Rod Coleman
RE Brady Smith

LB Keith Brooking
LB Jamie Duncan
LB Matt Stewart
LB Demorrio Williams
CB Deangelo Hall
CB Jason Webster
CB Derek Ross
FS Corey Hall
SS Keion Carpenter

K Jay Feely
P Chris Mohr

-i must admit the Falcons look better then the saints, and around near the same talent as the Panthers.


Tampa Bay Buccaneers
QB Brad Johnson
RB Charlie Garner
FB Mike Alstott
WR Keenan McCardell
WR Joey Galloway
WR Michael Clayton
TE Ken Dilger/Rickey Dudley
LT Derrick Deese
LG Matt Stinchcomb
C John Wade
RG Cosey Coleman/Matt Odwer
RT Todd Steussie

LE Greg Spires
DT Anthony McFarland
DT Ellis Wyms
RE Simeon Rice
LB Derrick Brooks
LB Ian Gold
LB Shelton Quarles
CB Ronde Barber
CB Brian Kelly
CB Mario Edwards
FS Dwight Smith
SS Jermaine Phillips

K Martin Gramatica
P Josh Bidwell

-This team may regain control of the division, as they look darn good on paper.


you have to remove Muhammad he's sure as gone in Charlotte

[Gman_NC]

Originally posted by BaDaBinGnRT
Carolina Panthers

QB Jake Delhomme
RB Stephen Davis
FB Brad Hoover
WR Steve Smith
WR Mushin Muhhamid
WR Ricky Proehl
TE Kris Magmum
LT Jorgan Gross
LG Travelle Wharton
C Jeff Mitchell
RG Doug Brezinski
RT Adam Meadows

LE Julius Peppers
DT Kris Jenkins
DT Breston Buckner
RE Mike Rucker
LB Will Witherspoon
LB Dan Morgan
LB Jessie Armstead
CB Ricky Manning Jr
CB Chris Gamble
CB Terrance Shaw
FS Mike Minter
SS Jarrod Cooper

K John Kasey
P Todd Sauerbrun



---NOT LOOKING TO GOOD FOR THEM. Decent team, but no way they even come close to repeating last years performance.

New Orlean Saints

QB Aaron Brooks
RB Deuce McAllister
FB Sam Gash
WR Joe Horn
WR Donte' Stalworth
WR Jerome Pathon
TE Boo Williams/Ernie Conwell
LT Wayne Gandy
LG LeCharles Bentley
C Kevin Houser
RG Montrae Holland
RT Victor Riley

LE Darren Howard
DT Johnathon Sullivan
DT Brian Young
RE Will Smith
LB Courtney Watson
LB Orlando Ruff
LB Sedrick Hodge
CB Ashley Ambrose
CB Fred Thomas
CB Jason Craft
FS Tebucky Jones
SS Jay Bellemy

K John Carney
P Mitch Berger

-Ugh....another sub par season for them looks in the making. That defense is horrific with exception to the average D line.


Atlanta Falcons
QB Mike Vick
RB Warrick Dunn
FB Justin Griffith
WR Peerless Price
WR Dez White
WR Michael Jenkins
TE Alge Crumpler
LT Bob Whitfield
LG Eric Beverely
C Robert Garza
RG Kynan Forney
RT Kevin Shaffer

LE Patrick Kerney
DT Rod Coleman
RE Brady Smith

LB Keith Brooking
LB Jamie Duncan
LB Matt Stewart
LB Demorrio Williams
CB Deangelo Hall
CB Jason Webster
CB Derek Ross
FS Corey Hall
SS Keion Carpenter

K Jay Feely
P Chris Mohr

-i must admit the Falcons look better then the saints, and around near the same talent as the Panthers.


Tampa Bay Buccaneers
QB Brad Johnson
RB Charlie Garner
FB Mike Alstott
WR Keenan McCardell
WR Joey Galloway
WR Michael Clayton
TE Ken Dilger/Rickey Dudley
LT Derrick Deese
LG Matt Stinchcomb
C John Wade
RG Cosey Coleman/Matt Odwer
RT Todd Steussie

LE Greg Spires
DT Anthony McFarland
DT Ellis Wyms
RE Simeon Rice
LB Derrick Brooks
LB Ian Gold
LB Shelton Quarles
CB Ronde Barber
CB Brian Kelly
CB Mario Edwards
FS Dwight Smith
SS Jermaine Phillips

K Martin Gramatica
P Josh Bidwell

-This team may regain control of the division, as they look darn good on paper.

Uh, exactly how does this prove that the bucs are on top again? Every team has added some good players in the off season and in the draft. Not sure how posting the current rosters proves anything. the game is played on the field. Not on paper.

[Gman_NC]

Originally posted by BucFanInIL
you have to remove Muhammad he's sure as gone in Charlotte

Not sure if thats true. The panthers have already said over and over that Muhammad isnt going anywhere. Unless somthing happens, all indications are that he will be back next year.

[BucFanInIL]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
The Bucs D still looks pretty solid, but unless Brad plays over his head (which he won't), I don't see that offense making any noise..... You better hope the D carries you again ala 2002.....


Brad won't be our gunslinger.... Chris Simms will

Alstott, Garner and White will provide enough rushing attack and catches out of backfield to even pace

And the Bucs top 5 WR's have enough potential, stress potential, to be the best corps in the league


I agree our TE's and OL are still debateable though

[BucFanInIL]

Originally posted by Gman_NC
Not sure if thats true. The panthers have already said over and over that Muhammad isnt going anywhere. Unless somthing happens, all indications are that he will be back next year.


As does Gruden in talking about Brad....


If Muhammad is a Panther next year it would be a greater miracle than dividing the Red Sea or turning water to win

you don't draft WR's in top 3 rounds unless you expect them to play... and Proehl can play #1 Slot

[Gman_NC]

Originally posted by BucFanInIL
As does Gruden in talking about Brad....


If Muhammad is a Panther next year it would be a greater miracle than dividing the Red Sea or turning water to win

you don't draft WR's in top 3 rounds unless you expect them to play... and Proehl can play #1 Slot

I wouldnt say all that. Colbert was drafted to eventually replace Muhammad, but he will not start this year. He will probably be the #3 receiver behind Smith and Muhammad. Ricky Prohel is supposed to be our #4 receiver. He moved up to #3 last year only because Kevin Dyson was injured and missed most of the seson. I have alot of reason to beleive Moose will be back next year, but I wouldnt be totally shocked if he wasnt.

[2HeadedMonster]

Originally posted by BucFanInIL
As does Gruden in talking about Brad....


If Muhammad is a Panther next year it would be a greater miracle than dividing the Red Sea or turning water to win

you don't draft WR's in top 3 rounds unless you expect them to play... and Proehl can play #1 Slot

You don't draft WR's and put them right on the field unless you have to, idiot. We drafted Keary Colbert and Drew Carter for depth, and to eventually replace Muhammad once they've developed(which will likely only be one season).

[Fantasyplayer87]

Originally posted by BaDaBinGnRT
-This team may regain control of the division, as they look darn good on paper.

To bad; it isn't what is on paper that counts:(

[2HeadedMonster]

Originally posted by UdinG
Panthers - 2nd coming of the 2001 Bears. Fluke. They'll stink this year.

You can't compare a team that made it to the Super Bowl to a team that was knocked out in the first round.

[J.C.BUC]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Old man Galloway doesn't have what JJ had last year....... and Brad Johnson is only going to get worse as he pushes 40......


True! no injury for Galloway! and Johnson will be fine with our new! or "old" offensive line! he won't have to say "oh look clouds! :D

[AF Go Bucs]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
The Bucs D still looks pretty solid, but unless Brad plays over his head (which he won't), I don't see that offense making any noise..... You better hope the D carries you again ala 2002.....

If Brad can get protection from the O-Line, he can be very solid. It's a big if. Especially early in the season when the newly formed line is trying to play as a unit. As far as the topic goes, I think all 4 teams have good and bad about them. I don't believe one team really stands out above the rest.

[figment086]

-the bucs are gonna have a good year this year.
-i really think we are gonna have to do battle with is Atlanta
-Saints are good but buts can take them.
-and Carolina had a good season last year so their heads are
still gonna be a little bog even though they lost the SB they arent
gonna think the bucs as being a huge threat like we did to them
and were gonna sweep them

IMO

[BALDAWG]

the panthers defense looks like the bucs defense from two years ago....and offensively they will improve a little so don't count them out...the saints are too inconsistent.....This is the year we find out michael vick isn't god .....and the bucs are going to give up at least 20 points a game.....i give the division to the panthers...then saints .... BUCS .....falcons

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by UdinG
I totally agree. Barring injuries, the Bucs should easily win the division.

Falcons - improved, but not there yet. Vick has nightmares about playing the Bucs.

The Bucs will most likely be the only one of these teams with a winning record this year.


You are officially the blindest Buc homer with the worst posts on this board by far....... The Bucs won't easily win anything, trust me.....

As to your Vick comment...... The Bucs are only 2-1 vs Vick, so this played out old comment doesn't hold water (see last game in December).

When the season is over, we will all laugh at you when the Bucs aren't the only team in the NFC South with a winning record, K? :rolleyes:

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by Bucamaniac40
Review the O line upgrades and call us back!



When they actually play an NFL game as a unit and prove something, I will be waiting for your phone call......

[FriendlyFr47]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Old man Galloway doesn't have what JJ had last year....... and Brad Johnson is only going to get worse as he pushes 40......

Calling everyone else a homer - meanwhile consulting with Dionne Warwicke and Miss Cleo. You're a joke, statboy.

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by FriendlyFr47
Calling everyone else a homer - meanwhile consulting with Dionne Warwicke and Miss Cleo. You're a joke, statboy.


Gallow IS old, JJ was good last year, and Brad Johnson is pushing 40....... Your comments make no sense like usual..... :rolleyes:

[cobraboy]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Old man Galloway doesn't have what JJ had last year....... and Brad Johnson is only going to get worse as he pushes 40...... Uh.....JJ hardly played last year...

[FriendlyFr47]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Gallow IS old, JJ was good last year, and Brad Johnson is pushing 40....... Your comments make no sense like usual..... :rolleyes:

Gallow, huh? You must mean Gallo - like that rotgut you're drinking to come up with these intelligent posts. We'll see you in the regular season - on the bottom as usual!

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by cobraboy
Uh.....JJ hardly played last year...


My point was that a sub-par JJ is better then a older Galloway any day of the week...... Joey is past his prime and proved it the last 3 years......

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by FriendlyFr47
Gallow, huh? You must mean Gallo - like that rotgut you're drinking to come up with these intelligent posts. We'll see you in the regular season - on the bottom as usual!


That's funny.... I could swear we weren't in last in 2002..... 2003 was for obvious reasons..... :rolleyes:

[FriendlyFr47]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
That's funny.... I could swear we weren't in last in 2002..... 2003 was for obvious reasons..... :rolleyes:


More excuses statboy? Nobody can spin it like you - but it still smells the same. Roll your eyes again, will ya? I just love that.

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by FriendlyFr47
More excuses statboy? Nobody can spin it like you - but it still smells the same. Roll your eyes again, will ya? I just love that.


Spin what cheesepuff? We made the playoffs in 2002 and had 2 JV QB's come in to replace Vick last year, why would you say that we are always on the bottom? You NEVER make an ounce of sense in your debates..... You are just mad because I can drill any one of your Falcon put downs into the dirt each and every argument...... You want so bad for your smack to match what you think in your heart about how bad the Falcons are, and trust me, it will never happen......

Go ahead FFR..... call me statboy again, so that it put's up one of your famous smoke screens in our disagreements once again..... And by the way, it really isn't very funny!

[FriendlyFr47]

:D :cool: :D

Truth hurts doesn't it. Look around - no one with half a clue is biting on the garbage you're spewing. Shoot this down, will ya?

[BucPride2003]

...Calm down. Why can't we just be friends? :)

[krazrussian]

You know what, I’ve had just about enough of the “OMG, Praise Vick for he is Jesus” from some of you Falcons trolls. So, here’s a dose of reality for you. I hate to break this to Falcon fans, but Vick is not that great of a QB. I know the Atlanta Trolls are gonna jump all over me for this one, but, let me explain my point. He's not that good at QB for several reasons:

1) Accuracy. Vick has a 52.2% career completion percentage. In his best season, he had a "whopping" 54.9%. I know, some will counter "he has no players around him" a point I will dispute in a sec, and that "he's young". Ok, Vick is young, and he does need time to learn the system. BUT, he has an advantage no other QB has. Every other QB in the league has to worry about forcing the ball into tight coverage or hurried/intentionally thrown away passes or forced throws into coverage due to heavy pressure. I would say that, on average, a QB in the NFL has about 7 incomplete passes per game resulting from either being hurried, or intentionally throwing the ball away, and thats probably being generous. 7 incomplete * 16 games = 112 incomplete passes. Thats 20% of the TOTAL number of passes Peyton Manning threw last year.

How does this apply to Vick? Simple, because of his PHENOMENAL legs, he doesn't have to worry about this issue NEARLY as much, even as much as QB's with a better O-line. Why? Come on now, Vick runs well under 4.4 in a 40. No defensive end, or defensive tackle can catch him speed-wize. I can't think of a linebacker that can either. This means that Vick, with his ability to roll out and be a lethal threat as a scambler does not have to throw the ball away nearly as much, nor to hurry his throws because he can create time for himself. So, if we cut down the number of the aforementioned throws to say 3, or 4 (again, being generous), which means he has 3 or 4 less of these forced incompletes per game. Using his best year, 2002, when he played 15 games; 3 * 15 games = 45 less forced imcompletes or 15 * 4 = 60. Vick threw 421 passes in 2002, so 45 less would be 10.6% and 60 less would be 14.3%.

So, what does that mean? That means, using the best-case scenario for Vick at 3 less forced incompletes, that still give him a 10.7% accuracy boost from all other quarterbacks in the NFL that can't do what he does with his legs. And yet, the top 15 starting quarterbacks in the league, not including Vick, all have at least a 63% completion percentage or better. So, when you compare Vick's 54.9%, in his BEST year, to an average of 63%, and either subtract 10.7% from Vicks total for the percentage of passes he WOULD have completed if he were not so mobile, or add 10.7% to 63 if the others were, and you get a difference of 18.8%. The conclusion from all of this..... without his legs, Michael Vick has a completion percentage WELL below 50%, not even cracking 45% in his best season. Not very appealing is it? NO, good, lets move on


2) The supporting cast. This is the second excuse Falcons fans used. "Michael Vick had no one around him." True, Vick's supporting cast is abysmal. Then again, Dan Marino never really had a dominating receiver, or a running back for that matter throughout his career. Favre, in his prime, didn't either (not talking about Ahman GReen, before they drafted him, because Levens had ONE good year, and Favre TURNED Freeman and BRooks and other into good receivers). Neither did McNabb (who I know a lot of folks thinks is over-rated, but this guy is DAMN good). They managed to make due, some better than others. Here's a good quote to follow: "Good Quarterbacks MAKE players around them good, not the other way around." If you want proof of this, look no further than former MVP, and the man who I've ALWAYS said was over=rated, Kurt Warner.

3) Let's move on. Here’s another pickle. Not sure how many people will agree, but Vick has one of, if not the strongest arm in the league. I mean, this guy can straight launch the ball (and yet, for some reason, many of his passes don’t have nearly enough zip). That said, where the hell is Atlanta’s deep threat? They have relatively speedy guys, and Vick, as mentioned before, can easily create time to throw in the pocket. So where the hell is it? The rule of thumb for the NFL is that receivers are generally faster than corners, and certainly faster than most safeties. So why don’t we see more 50-yard plays? Because Vick would rather scramble.


Now THERE are your numbers. If you want to talk stats and facts, the above ones speak for themselves. So I really don't know what is more laughable, that you worship the above-described Vick as a God, or that you collapse in anguish when he goes down.

[CatSackFever]

Vick is one of the top running backs in the league

[salt_n_peppers]

Originally posted by BaDaBinGnRT
Carolina Panthers

QB Jake Delhomme
RB Stephen Davis
FB Brad Hoover
WR Steve Smith
WR Mushin Muhhamid
WR Ricky Proehl
TE Kris Magmum
LT Jorgan Gross
LG Travelle Wharton
C Jeff Mitchell
RG Doug Brezinski
RT Adam Meadows

LE Julius Peppers
DT Kris Jenkins
DT Breston Buckner
RE Mike Rucker
LB Will Witherspoon
LB Dan Morgan
LB Mark Fields
CB Ricky Manning Jr
CB Chris Gamble
CB Terrance Shaw
FS Mike Minter
SS Jarrod Cooper

K John Kasey
P Todd Sauerbrun



---NOT LOOKING TO GOOD FOR THEM. Decent team, but no way they even come close to repeating last years performance.

New Orlean Saints

QB Aaron Brooks
RB Deuce McAllister
FB Sam Gash
WR Joe Horn
WR Donte' Stalworth
WR Jerome Pathon
TE Boo Williams/Ernie Conwell
LT Wayne Gandy
LG LeCharles Bentley
C Kevin Houser
RG Montrae Holland
RT Victor Riley

LE Darren Howard
DT Johnathon Sullivan
DT Brian Young
RE Will Smith
LB Courtney Watson
LB Orlando Ruff
LB Sedrick Hodge
CB Ashley Ambrose
CB Fred Thomas
CB Jason Craft
FS Tebucky Jones
SS Jay Bellemy

K John Carney
P Mitch Berger

-Ugh....another sub par season for them looks in the making. That defense is horrific with exception to the average D line.


Atlanta Falcons
QB Mike Vick
RB Warrick Dunn
FB Justin Griffith
WR Peerless Price
WR Dez White
WR Michael Jenkins
TE Alge Crumpler
LT Bob Whitfield
LG Eric Beverely
C Robert Garza
RG Kynan Forney
RT Kevin Shaffer

LE Patrick Kerney
DT Rod Coleman
RE Brady Smith

LB Keith Brooking
LB Jamie Duncan
LB Matt Stewart
LB Demorrio Williams
CB Deangelo Hall
CB Jason Webster
CB Derek Ross
FS Corey Hall
SS Keion Carpenter

K Jay Feely
P Chris Mohr

-i must admit the Falcons look better then the saints, and around near the same talent as the Panthers.


Tampa Bay Buccaneers
QB Brad Johnson
RB Charlie Garner
FB Mike Alstott
WR Keenan McCardell
WR Joey Galloway
WR Michael Clayton
TE Ken Dilger/Rickey Dudley
LT Derrick Deese
LG Matt Stinchcomb
C John Wade
RG Cosey Coleman/Matt Odwer
RT Todd Steussie

LE Greg Spires
DT Anthony McFarland
DT Ellis Wyms
RE Simeon Rice
LB Derrick Brooks
LB Ian Gold
LB Shelton Quarles
CB Ronde Barber
CB Brian Kelly
CB Mario Edwards
FS Dwight Smith
SS Jermaine Phillips

K Martin Gramatica
P Josh Bidwell

-This team may regain control of the division, as they look darn good on paper. take out armstead put in Mark Fields

[UdinG]

Originally posted by salt_n_peppers
take out armstead put in Mark Fields

Why would they downgrade to Fields? Pity for his illness?

[PanthersFan17]

his doctor said that he'll be ready on whole 100%, he got his physical power back, Fields is coming back...

[PanthersFan17]

Carolina Panthers

QB Jake Delhomme
RB Stephen Davis/DeShaun Foster
FB Brad Hoover
WR Steve Smith
WR Mushin Muhammad
WR Keary Colbert
TE Kris Magmum
LT Jorgan Gross
LG Travelle Wharton
C Jeff Mitchell
RG Doug Brezinski
RT Adam Meadows

LE Julius Peppers
DT Kris Jenkins
DT Breston Buckner
RE Mike Rucker
LB Will Witherspoon
LB Dan Morgan
LB Mark Fields
CB Ricky Manning Jr
CB Chris Gamble
CB Artrell Hawkins
FS Mike Minter
SS unknown There still possibility of drafting some1 after June 1st.

K John Kasey
P Todd Sauerbrun

here, fix it for u...

[buccaneer49]

Originally posted by CatSackFever
Vick is one of the top running backs in the league

Then only use him as a RB, kraryrussion has made some awesome points, Vick has great legs, but his stats as a QB..are not that impressive:D

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by krazrussian
You know what, I’ve had just about enough of the “OMG, Praise Vick for he is Jesus” from some of you Falcons trolls. So, here’s a dose of reality for you. I hate to break this to Falcon fans, but Vick is not that great of a QB. I know the Atlanta Trolls are gonna jump all over me for this one, but, let me explain my point. He's not that good at QB for several reasons:

1) Accuracy. Vick has a 52.2% career completion percentage. In his best season, he had a "whopping" 54.9%. I know, some will counter "he has no players around him" a point I will dispute in a sec, and that "he's young". Ok, Vick is young, and he does need time to learn the system. BUT, he has an advantage no other QB has. Every other QB in the league has to worry about forcing the ball into tight coverage or hurried/intentionally thrown away passes or forced throws into coverage due to heavy pressure. I would say that, on average, a QB in the NFL has about 7 incomplete passes per game resulting from either being hurried, or intentionally throwing the ball away, and thats probably being generous. 7 incomplete * 16 games = 112 incomplete passes. Thats 20% of the TOTAL number of passes Peyton Manning threw last year.

How does this apply to Vick? Simple, because of his PHENOMENAL legs, he doesn't have to worry about this issue NEARLY as much, even as much as QB's with a better O-line. Why? Come on now, Vick runs well under 4.4 in a 40. No defensive end, or defensive tackle can catch him speed-wize. I can't think of a linebacker that can either. This means that Vick, with his ability to roll out and be a lethal threat as a scambler does not have to throw the ball away nearly as much, nor to hurry his throws because he can create time for himself. So, if we cut down the number of the aforementioned throws to say 3, or 4 (again, being generous), which means he has 3 or 4 less of these forced incompletes per game. Using his best year, 2002, when he played 15 games; 3 * 15 games = 45 less forced imcompletes or 15 * 4 = 60. Vick threw 421 passes in 2002, so 45 less would be 10.6% and 60 less would be 14.3%.

So, what does that mean? That means, using the best-case scenario for Vick at 3 less forced incompletes, that still give him a 10.7% accuracy boost from all other quarterbacks in the NFL that can't do what he does with his legs. And yet, the top 15 starting quarterbacks in the league, not including Vick, all have at least a 63% completion percentage or better. So, when you compare Vick's 54.9%, in his BEST year, to an average of 63%, and either subtract 10.7% from Vicks total for the percentage of passes he WOULD have completed if he were not so mobile, or add 10.7% to 63 if the others were, and you get a difference of 18.8%. The conclusion from all of this..... without his legs, Michael Vick has a completion percentage WELL below 50%, not even cracking 45% in his best season. Not very appealing is it? NO, good, lets move on


2) The supporting cast. This is the second excuse Falcons fans used. "Michael Vick had no one around him." True, Vick's supporting cast is abysmal. Then again, Dan Marino never really had a dominating receiver, or a running back for that matter throughout his career. Favre, in his prime, didn't either (not talking about Ahman GReen, before they drafted him, because Levens had ONE good year, and Favre TURNED Freeman and BRooks and other into good receivers). Neither did McNabb (who I know a lot of folks thinks is over-rated, but this guy is DAMN good). They managed to make due, some better than others. Here's a good quote to follow: "Good Quarterbacks MAKE players around them good, not the other way around." If you want proof of this, look no further than former MVP, and the man who I've ALWAYS said was over=rated, Kurt Warner.

3) Let's move on. Here’s another pickle. Not sure how many people will agree, but Vick has one of, if not the strongest arm in the league. I mean, this guy can straight launch the ball (and yet, for some reason, many of his passes don’t have nearly enough zip). That said, where the hell is Atlanta’s deep threat? They have relatively speedy guys, and Vick, as mentioned before, can easily create time to throw in the pocket. So where the hell is it? The rule of thumb for the NFL is that receivers are generally faster than corners, and certainly faster than most safeties. So why don’t we see more 50-yard plays? Because Vick would rather scramble.


Now THERE are your numbers. If you want to talk stats and facts, the above ones speak for themselves. So I really don't know what is more laughable, that you worship the above-described Vick as a God, or that you collapse in anguish when he goes down.


Thanks for wasting your time with all the analysis....... The funny thing is, Vick is only 23 years old and has only started one full season in the NFL along with his 3-1 record last year...... The guy wins games, has went to the playoffs, and has accomplished more then most QB's have in their first year a starter!

For you to criticize Vicks talents this early in his career at 23 is just rediculous....... Most Falcons and/or Vick fans realize the kid still needs to learn the NFL and work on aspects of his game...... For you to think he should have Dan Marino numbers this early is laughable.... Nobody can predict the future, but I am going to go out on a limb and guess that by the time the kid is Brad Johnson's age at 36 or whatever, he will be 10 times the QB that BJ could ever dream of.......

Bottom line, Vick is a playmaker and has proven that even with a crappy team and coach calling the plays, he is a QB that most teams, coaches, and fans would want on their team as the starting QB.......

[All_da_way]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Thanks for wasting your time with all the analysis....... The funny thing is, Vick is only 23 years old and has only started one full season in the NFL along with his 3-1 record last year...... The guy wins games, has went to the playoffs, and has accomplished more then most QB's have in their first year a starter!

For you to criticize Vicks talents this early in his career at 23 is just rediculous....... Most Falcons and/or Vick fans realize the kid still needs to learn the NFL and work on aspects of his game...... For you to think he should have Dan Marino numbers this early is laughable.... Nobody can predict the future, but I am going to go out on a limb and guess that by the time the kid is Brad Johnson's age at 36 or whatever, he will be 10 times the QB that BJ could ever dream of.......

Bottom line, Vick is a playmaker and has proven that even with a crappy team and coach calling the plays, he is a QB that most teams, coaches, and fans would want on their team as the starting QB.......

:rolleyes: :p

http://img62.photobucket.com/albums/v189/woods06/Vick1.jpg

[phinfan34]

Galloway wasn't even a top 2 WR in Dallas. He isn't going to come to Tampa and dominate.

[J.C.BUC]

Vick! " A dead President" I never knew! :D

[BigSaint8050]

Dude do you even know what you are talking about????

New Orlean Saints

QB Aaron Brooks
RB Deuce McAllister
FB Sam Gash
WR Joe Horn
WR Donte' Stalworth
WR Jerome Pathon
TE Boo Williams/Ernie Conwell
LT Wayne Gandy
LG LeCharles Bentley
C Kevin Houser
RG Montrae Holland
RT Victor Riley

LE Darren Howard
DT Johnathon Sullivan
DT Brian Young
RE Will Smith
LB Courtney Watson
LB Orlando Ruff
LB Sedrick Hodge
CB Ashley Ambrose
CB Fred Thomas
CB Jason Craft
FS Tebucky Jones
SS Jay Bellemy

K John Carney
P Mitch Berger

Lets start at the top, we have two FB's in Sam Gash and Mike Karney and I wouldn't expect Gash to be around at the start of the season. You also forgot Devery Henderson at WR, which is not big deal, but he will see significant playing time.

Now lets get to the real part that shows you have no idea of what you are talking about.... Offensive line; LT Wayne Gandy LG: LeCharles Bentley C Kevin Houser RG Montrea Holland RT Victor Riley.... ok you got Gandy and Riley right. LeCharles Bentley is playing center this year, where he played in college and Montrea Holland is our LG with Kendyl Jacox starting at RG. Kevin freakin Houser at center???? He is a our friggin long snapper for crying out loud.

Now on to other things. Defense.... Charles Grant and Darren Howard are our starters at DE..... With Will Smith in the rotation. Sederick Hodge is our starting stong side linebacker and right now it looks like Coutney Waston will play middle and Cie Grant or Derrick Rodgers will start on the weak side. Our CB depth will be Fred Thomas/Jason Craft/Ashley Ambrose btw.

Do you even watch football?

Here is the current roster

QB Aaron Brooks/Todd Bouman/JT O'Sullivan
RB Deuce McAllister/Aaron Stecker
FB Mike Karney
WR Joe Horn/Devery Henderson/Germaine Crowell
WR Donte' Stalworth/Jerome Paton
TE Boo Williams/Ernie Conwell/Zach Hilton
LT Wayne Gandy/Johnathan Stinchcomb
LG Montrea Holland/Jamar Nesbit
C LeCharles Bentley/Jerry Fontenot
RG Kendyl Jacox
RT Victor Riley/Spencer Falou

LE Charles Grant/Will Smith/Melvin Williams
DT Johnathon Sullivan/Rodney Leisle
DT Brian Young/Kenny Smith
RE Darren Howard/Willie Whithead
SLB Sederick Hodge/James Allen
MLB Courney Watson/Orlando Ruff
WLB Cie Grant/Derrick Rodgers/Colby Bockwoldt
CB Fred Thomas/Ashely Ambrose/Ahmad Brooks
CB Jason Craft/Fakir Brown/Keyou Craver
FS Tebucky Jones/Steve Gleason/Brent Hafford
SS Jay Bellemy/Mel Mitchell

K John Carney
P Mitch Berger
LS Kevin Houser

[Se7en_Dust]

Just a tip on Atlanta's roster. We are not playing in the 3-4 anymore. Our starting secondary isn't set yet except for Bryan Scott @ SS. Bob Whitfield is now a backup, and Todd Weiner is our RT. Shaffer is the LT.

[All_da_way]

Originally posted by BigSaint8050
Dude do you even know what you are talking about????

New Orlean Saints

QB Aaron Brooks
RB Deuce McAllister
FB Sam Gash
WR Joe Horn
WR Donte' Stalworth
WR Jerome Pathon
TE Boo Williams/Ernie Conwell
LT Wayne Gandy
LG LeCharles Bentley
C Kevin Houser
RG Montrae Holland
RT Victor Riley

LE Darren Howard
DT Johnathon Sullivan
DT Brian Young
RE Will Smith
LB Courtney Watson
LB Orlando Ruff
LB Sedrick Hodge
CB Ashley Ambrose
CB Fred Thomas
CB Jason Craft
FS Tebucky Jones
SS Jay Bellemy

K John Carney
P Mitch Berger

Lets start at the top, we have two FB's in Sam Gash and Mike Karney and I wouldn't expect Gash to be around at the start of the season. You also forgot Devery Henderson at WR, which is not big deal, but he will see significant playing time.

Now lets get to the real part that shows you have no idea of what you are talking about.... Offensive line; LT Wayne Gandy LG: LeCharles Bentley C Kevin Houser RG Montrea Holland RT Victor Riley.... ok you got Gandy and Riley right. LeCharles Bentley is playing center this year, where he played in college and Montrea Holland is our LG with Kendyl Jacox starting at RG. Kevin freakin Houser at center???? He is a our friggin long snapper for crying out loud.

Now on to other things. Defense.... Charles Grant and Darren Howard are our starters at DE..... With Will Smith in the rotation. Sederick Hodge is our starting stong side linebacker and right now it looks like Coutney Waston will play middle and Cie Grant or Derrick Rodgers will start on the weak side. Our CB depth will be Fred Thomas/Jason Craft/Ashley Ambrose btw.

Do you even watch football?

Here is the current roster

QB Aaron Brooks/Todd Bouman/JT O'Sullivan
RB Deuce McAllister/Aaron Stecker
FB Mike Karney
WR Joe Horn/Devery Henderson/Germaine Crowell
WR Donte' Stalworth/Jerome Paton
TE Boo Williams/Ernie Conwell/Zach Hilton
LT Wayne Gandy/Johnathan Stinchcomb
LG Montrea Holland/Jamar Nesbit
C LeCharles Bentley/Jerry Fontenot
RG Kendyl Jacox
RT Victor Riley/Spencer Falou

LE Charles Grant/Will Smith/Melvin Williams
DT Johnathon Sullivan/Rodney Leisle
DT Brian Young/Kenny Smith
RE Darren Howard/Willie Whithead
SLB Sederick Hodge/James Allen
MLB Courney Watson/Orlando Ruff
WLB Cie Grant/Derrick Rodgers/Colby Bockwoldt
CB Fred Thomas/Ashely Ambrose/Ahmad Brooks
CB Jason Craft/Fakir Brown/Keyou Craver
FS Tebucky Jones/Steve Gleason/Brent Hafford
SS Jay Bellemy/Mel Mitchell

K John Carney
P Mitch Berger
LS Kevin Houser

Are you talking to me or that Benjamin up there???:confused:

[Poleaxe]

As far as the origional post goes:

I'm not sure how anyone other than a homer can compare NFC South starting rosters and come away with any thoughts other than anything can happen. I see relative parity.

OTOH, it is the Bucs board. If you can't be a homer on your own board, where can you?

[salt_n_peppers]

Originally posted by UdinG
Why would they downgrade to Fields? Pity for his illness? fields is done with his treatments. he will have few exams or xrays to see if he is ok. doctors say fields can return in june if he is ok.

[BigSaint8050]

Originally posted by Poleaxe
As far as the origional post goes:

I'm not sure how anyone other than a homer can compare NFC South starting rosters and come away with any thoughts other than anything can happen. I see relative parity.

OTOH, it is the Bucs board. If you can't be a homer on your own board, where can you?

Not you All the Way....., I was speaking to who ever posted these unreal rosters. They have no clue what they are talking about.

[Puddinhead]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Bottom line, Vick is a playmaker and has proven that even with a crappy team and coach calling the plays, he is a QB that most teams, coaches, and fans would want on their team as the starting QB.......

I think it's only fair to point out....that "crappy coach" has coached three different teams to Conference Championship games, and two different teams to the Super Bowl four different times. I'd put a lot more emphasis on the "crappy team" part, and less on the "crappy coach". In fact, it seems fairly obvious that what you guys have in Atlanta is a clear cut case of "NBA-itis" with your team. Your superstar player (much like players such as Jason Kidd have been known to do) has led an organized effort to get rid of a coach that he's decided he didn't like for some reason--maybe his practices are too tough, or he expects everyone to play within a proven system rather than free-lance. At any rate, I'm sure Arthur Blank called Vick first to ask him if it was OK to hire little Jimmy Mora as his coach, so you shouldn't have to worry about Vick taking twelve weeks to return from a six week injury again--this year.

[krazrussian]

"Thanks for wasting your time with all the analysis....... The funny thing is, Vick is only 23 years old and has only started one full season in the NFL along with his 3-1 record last year...... The guy wins games, has went to the playoffs, and has accomplished more then most QB's have in their first year a starter!

For you to criticize Vicks talents this early in his career at 23 is just rediculous....... Most Falcons and/or Vick fans realize the kid still needs to learn the NFL and work on aspects of his game...... For you to think he should have Dan Marino numbers this early is laughable.... Nobody can predict the future, but I am going to go out on a limb and guess that by the time the kid is Brad Johnson's age at 36 or whatever, he will be 10 times the QB that BJ could ever dream of.......

Bottom line, Vick is a playmaker and has proven that even with a crappy team and coach calling the plays, he is a QB that most teams, coaches, and fans would want on their team as the starting QB....... "

So FalconArmy, why not respond to my post at all? What's the matter, did you just realize that EVERYTHING I said about Vick is true? You think I can't criticize Vick this early in his career? THe guy has been in the league for 3 years. He should STILL at least have a 58% completion percentage because that is borderline acceptable. Hell, Manning threw 58%, even factoring in the forced incompletes I mentioned in my first post, in his rookie season. Vick has yet to break the 55% mark before factoring out forced incompletes.

Call him a "playmaker" or a "winner" if you want, but the ONLY reason this happens is because the guy is basically a running back with an arm. It will take some more time for teams to adjust to covering his type of play, but believe me, it will happend. You cant' avoid it, eventually Vick will not be able to rely on his scrambling ability and actually become a QB, you know, complete passes, read defenses, command a team and the like. The bottom line is, he is not even close to making this transition, and while he certainly has the potential, I don't see it happening.

[magic-Bucsfan]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Old man Galloway doesn't have what JJ had last year....... and Brad Johnson is only going to get worse as he pushes 40......

Galloway is a deep threat, and stretches the field. and we have a better o-line, more time for brad to throw=less mistakes.

[magic-Bucsfan]

Originally posted by CatSackFever
Vick is one of the top running backs in the league

vick should be a rb, put someone else at qb.

[magic-Bucsfan]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Thanks for wasting your time with all the analysis....... The funny thing is, Vick is only 23 years old and has only started one full season in the NFL along with his 3-1 record last year...... The guy wins games, has went to the playoffs, and has accomplished more then most QB's have in their first year a starter!

For you to criticize Vicks talents this early in his career at 23 is just rediculous....... Most Falcons and/or Vick fans realize the kid still needs to learn the NFL and work on aspects of his game...... For you to think he should have Dan Marino numbers this early is laughable.... Nobody can predict the future, but I am going to go out on a limb and guess that by the time the kid is Brad Johnson's age at 36 or whatever, he will be 10 times the QB that BJ could ever dream of.......

Bottom line, Vick is a playmaker and has proven that even with a crappy team and coach calling the plays, he is a QB that most teams, coaches, and fans would want on their team as the starting QB.......

he needs to play like a QB, and not run every other play. he thinks he can make a big play happen everytime he runs. well, the bucs proved him wrong before, and will again. if you run that much, you need to be a rb. learn to thro vick.

[Puddinhead]

Originally posted by magic-Bucsfan
Galloway is a deep threat, and stretches the field. and we have a better o-line, more time for brad to throw=less mistakes.

You have a DIFFERENT offensive line...it remains to be seen if you have a BETTER offensive line or not. Remember, it was prior to last season that you were all telling me how you'd have one of the best offensive lines in the league last season because you'd added the best offensive line coach in the history of the NFL or something to work with them. Now, a season later, you're mixing and matching in an attempt to replace most of the guys who made up that unit.

[magic-Bucsfan]

Originally posted by Puddinhead
You have a DIFFERENT offensive line...it remains to be seen if you have a BETTER offensive line or not. Remember, it was prior to last season that you were all telling me how you'd have one of the best offensive lines in the league last season because you'd added the best offensive line coach in the history of the NFL or something to work with them. Now, a season later, you're mixing and matching in an attempt to replace most of the guys who made up that unit.

Kenyatta "facemasks are magnets to my hands" Walker got way too many holding penalties, drobe us back 10 yards. we have more experienced, and bigger linemen. they should be better than last years unit.

[PantherFan4Ever]

Originally posted by salt_n_peppers
fields is done with his treatments. he will have few exams or xrays to see if he is ok. doctors say fields can return in june if he is ok.

Obviously, many Bucs fans forget just how good Mark Fields is when healthy. He put up some fantastic numbers in 2002.

Defense Total Solo Asst Sacks QBP FF FR PD
Fields 127 79 48 7.5 8 7 2 5

[BadChuckee]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Gallow IS old, JJ was good last year, and Brad Johnson is pushing 40....... Your comments make no sense like usual..... :rolleyes: Since when is 35 pushing 40? I would worry more about Vick staying healthy, since he is your whole team. Until the falcons ACTUALLY do something, you call us back...... :rolleyes:

[Buc-Ball-4-life]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
The Bucs D still looks pretty solid, but unless Brad plays over his head (which he won't), I don't see that offense making any noise..... You better hope the D carries you again ala 2002.....

His 48 touchdowns and 7200+ yards over the last two years are most likely better then any 2 years that an Atlanta QB has ever had - Brad was not, is not, and will not be the problem with this offense. He ranks 3rd all time for completion percentage of QBs with atleast 1500 attempts behind only Young and Montana.

Let's see Vick play a few full seasons and win a superbowl - then talk

[Buc-Ball-4-life]

Originally posted by BucFanInIL
Brad won't be our gunslinger.... Chris Simms will

Alstott, Garner and White will provide enough rushing attack and catches out of backfield to even pace

And the Bucs top 5 WR's have enough potential, stress potential, to be the best corps in the league


I agree our TE's and OL are still debateable though

who are you kidding - brad will most definitely be our man

[Buc-Ball-4-life]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
My point was that a sub-par JJ is better then a older Galloway any day of the week...... Joey is past his prime and proved it the last 3 years......

and Galloway is still better then any Falcon receiver except maybe Pierless Price

[theDIRTYcode]

Originally posted by Buc-Ball-4-life
His 48 touchdowns and 7200+ yards over the last two years are most likely better then any 2 years that an Atlanta QB has ever had

Not so....of course, I don't expect you to know Steve Bartkowski since the wagon didn't cruise by until 2002. :p

Comp Att Comp % Yds Yds/Att TD Int Pass
Rating

1980:
257 463 55.5 3,544 7.65 31 16 88.2

1981:
297 533 55.7 3,829 7.18 30 23 79.2

[gipctech]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
Old man Galloway doesn't have what JJ had last year....... and Brad Johnson is only going to get worse as he pushes 40......

Galloway still has more left than any WR on the Falcons and Brad Johnson will still be a better QB than Vick even after he retires !!

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by gipctech
Galloway still has more left than any WR on the Falcons and Brad Johnson will still be a better QB than Vick even after he retires !!


You're reaching now Tech...... ;)

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by BadChuckee
Since when is 35 pushing 40? I would worry more about Vick staying healthy, since he is your whole team. Until the falcons ACTUALLY do something, you call us back...... :rolleyes:


He will be 36 when the season starts...... that is pushing 40 to me....

[BabyBuc]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
He will be 36 when the season starts...... that is pushing 40 to me....

Gee! I thought it would be more like 38/39.....I mean that's still mid thirties.:( ;)

[sounds7]

While it is important to have talent I think it is just as important, if not more so, to play as a team and with heart. Players not just trying to get personal stats but playing selflessly towards a common goal. This has been to Saints problem in the past not so much the Talent level. What encourages me about this season for our team are the intageables like we didnt lose any team leaders like in previous years. Continuity will be key for the Saints. We do not have to start completly from scratch with so many new faces as we have in the past. While I would have liked to have seen bigger changes in coaching this offseason we did add a new WR coach and deffensive line coach.
The Saints gave up too many yards on the ground last year and need to learn to tackle better. I am hoping the addition of Pease to our coaching line up will solve these issues. Deffense has been the thing we have focused on this offseason and last offseason. We still have missing pieces and I hope they aquire more talent at DB but we have infact improved in the trenches on both sides of the ball and that is where the real battle is fought.

[buccaneer49]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
He will be 36 when the season starts...... that is pushing 40 to me....

You must be very young if you think that way, take it from someone who has already hit both ages......you could look at it the other way too, he's just as close to age 30 as he is to 40, Don't put him in Football retirement home just yet, 35 is not old, not even in football.:rolleyes:

[Puddinhead]

Originally posted by buccaneer49
You must be very young if you think that way, take it from someone who has already hit both ages......you could look at it the other way too, he's just as close to age 30 as he is to 40, Don't put him in Football retirement home just yet, 35 is not old, not even in football.:rolleyes:

I pro sports, particularly in a spot where you make your living with your legs.....35 is old.

[AF Go Bucs]

Originally posted by Puddinhead
I pro sports, particularly in a spot where you make your living with your legs.....35 is old.

Rich Gannon was the MVP at age 36. It is old but does that mean that person won't be able to do well?

[Puddinhead]

Originally posted by AF Go Bucs
Rich Gannon was the MVP at age 36. It is old but does that mean that person won't be able to do well?

Rich Gannon wasn't sprinting pass routes every play.

[TheFalconArmy]

Originally posted by buccaneer49
You must be very young if you think that way, take it from someone who has already hit both ages......you could look at it the other way too, he's just as close to age 30 as he is to 40, Don't put him in Football retirement home just yet, 35 is not old, not even in football.:rolleyes:


Actually I am not far off from that age...... 36 years old is no spring chicken in the NFL, period!

[magic-Bucsfan]

Originally posted by Puddinhead
Rich Gannon wasn't sprinting pass routes every play.

neither was brad.

[YP2K]

Funny to see people talking crap about Vick (especially Saints and Panthers fans) The only stat that matters is wins...

When Vick plays, the Falcons are 6-2 vs NFC South (5-0 vs the Panthers and Saints)... nuff said!

[AF Go Bucs]

Originally posted by YP2K
Funny to see people talking crap about Vick (especially Saints and Panthers fans) The only stat that matters is wins...

When Vick plays, the Falcons are 6-2 vs NFC South (5-0 vs the Panthers and Saints)... nuff said!

When Brad Johnson plays for the Bucs, he is 1-2. One season with a Super Bowl victory, 2 without. Speaking of nuff said.

[sounds7]

Originally posted by YP2K
Funny to see people talking crap about Vick (especially Saints and Panthers fans) The only stat that matters is wins...

When Vick plays, the Falcons are 6-2 vs NFC South (5-0 vs the Panthers and Saints)... nuff said!

Vick is a great Quarterback and he has played well against the Saints no doubt however, you had to put the word "When" in front of the phrase "Vick plays"
"When" might be a common occurance with Vick in the future. If he doesn't become more of a pocket passer he will expose himself to more injuries by running so much. There is a reason running backs dont last as long in the NFL as other players. (The Pounding) Vick will need to think before he runs. Because he is so dangerous, teams will try to take him out. It will be interesting to see his post injury form this year.

[gipctech]

Originally posted by sounds7
Vick is a great Quarterback and he has played well against the Saints no doubt however, you had to put the word "When" in front of the phrase "Vick plays"
"When" might be a common occurance with Vick in the future. If he doesn't become more of a pocket passer he will expose himself to more injuries by running so much. There is a reason running backs dont last as long in the NFL as other players. (The Pounding) Vick will need to think before he runs. Because he is so dangerous, teams will try to take him out. It will be interesting to see his post injury form this year.

What's up Sounds? Glad to see you are still around !

[psyburn21]

Originally posted by YP2K
Funny to see people talking crap about Vick (especially Saints and Panthers fans) The only stat that matters is wins...

When Vick plays, the Falcons are 6-2 vs NFC South (5-0 vs the Panthers and Saints)... nuff said!

Until he becomes a great passer and not just a running QB, then I'll give him more respect. He does win games but if he keeps running the way he does, he won't finish most seasons he plays. Defenses are gunning for him now, and Price isn't a true #1 receiver.

[sounds7]

Originally posted by gipctech
What's up Sounds? Glad to see you are still around !

Yea GipCtec I lurk in the shadows for the most part. Every once in a while i come out of hiding and make a post if I feel I can add anything to a conversation. Offseason you know, not much to write about until the Pads go on and the hits start happenning for real.

[YP2K]

Originally posted by sounds7
Vick is a great Quarterback and he has played well against the Saints no doubt however, you had to put the word "When" in front of the phrase "Vick plays"
"When" might be a common occurance with Vick in the future. If he doesn't become more of a pocket passer he will expose himself to more injuries by running so much. There is a reason running backs dont last as long in the NFL as other players. (The Pounding) Vick will need to think before he runs. Because he is so dangerous, teams will try to take him out. It will be interesting to see his post injury form this year.

I guess you missed the last 4 games of the season? 3-1, with the loss being the week that Dan Reeves was fired.

Panthers and Bucs fans got a sneak peek... if you need to ask someone about it.

[Chunko]

Originally posted by YP2K
I guess you missed the last 4 games of the season? 3-1, with the loss being the week that Dan Reeves was fired.

And Vick played in those 4 games. Vick is a really good QB, but could have some durability issues throughout his career. That's what Sounds' point was.

[YP2K]

Originally posted by Chunko
And Vick played in those 4 games. Vick is a really good QB, but could have some durability issues throughout his career. That's what Sounds' point was.

He also said that it would be interesting to see what he looks like post-injury, and we've already seen that...

[BadChuckee]

Originally posted by Puddinhead
I pro sports, particularly in a spot where you make your living with your legs.....35 is old. Only a fan who has a QB that runs for a living would say that. QB's were meant to actually THROW the ball, not run. Leave the running to the players in the back field, who are actually paid to run with the football, not throw it... :rolleyes:

[BadChuckee]

Originally posted by YP2K
Funny to see people talking crap about Vick (especially Saints and Panthers fans) The only stat that matters is wins...

When Vick plays, the Falcons are 6-2 vs NFC South (5-0 vs the Panthers and Saints)... nuff said! Which got you what?? And where??;)

[psyburn21]

Originally posted by gipctech
Galloway still has more left than any WR on the Falcons and Brad Johnson will still be a better QB than Vick even after he retires !!

Uh, yeah right. Brad Johnson is a good QB, but Galloway isn't gonna turn around your offense the way you think he will. Michael Clayton, Keenan McCardell, and JJ are more than likely to do that than Galloway.

[YP2K]

Originally posted by BadChuckee
Which got you what?? And where??;)

Same place the Bucs were last season ;)

[sounds7]

The thing you also have to consider is when Vick faced the Saints defense two years ago we had been built for stopping Mike Alstott not Michael Vick. The Bucs running back had powered over us the privious year and knocked us out of the playoffs. We had a big slow defensive line back then (Lunch Bunch). Saints have went defense in the last two drafts with their #1 picks they have also brought in free agents to fill voids over the last two years. We added Tbucky Jones and Bryan Young Orlando Ruff etc. Not that any of those guys have made the Pro Bowl but they are solid players that improve our defense. This years defensive line is faster and deeper than in recent Saints memory and if I can remember right, It is the quick Physical defenses that have given Vick problems in the past like the Bucs and Ravens defenses. We are not where those defenses were yet but we are moving and focusing on that side of the ball while remaining intact on offense. Atlanta / Saints match ups have always been competitive nail bitters. I dont see either team running roughshod over the other this year. I see split with each team winning on their home turf.

[Smith_HiTtEr]

You can't tell..... But I say, Panthers do well with 10-6.

Saints will be 5-11.

Falcons will be 9-7.

Bucs- 10-6 and beat Panthers.

[Smith_HiTtEr]

Originally posted by YP2K
Same place the Bucs were last season ;)

Hate to say this but Bucs were basically second in the division, which is sad....

[sounds7]

Originally posted by Smith_HiTtEr
You can't tell..... But I say, Panthers do well with 10-6.

Saints will be 5-11.



LOL:rolleyes:

[theDIRTYcode]

Originally posted by Smith_HiTtEr
Hate to say this but Bucs were basically second in the division, which is sad....

Huh? New Orleans was second with a 8-8 record.

[YP2K]

Originally posted by theDIRTYcode
Huh? New Orleans was second with a 8-8 record.

Maybe he meant to say they were second to last?:confused:

[dbartdog]

Originally posted by TheFalconArmy
The Bucs D still looks pretty solid, but unless Brad plays over his head (which he won't), I don't see that offense making any noise..... You better hope the D carries you again ala 2002..... Bucs....long step backward......look for several years of mediocraty!